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	<title>Rakesh Agrawal's Blog &#187; tedrheingold</title>
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		<title>Ted Rheingold, Dogster&#8217;s founder and &#8220;Top Dog&#8221; speaks at FOWA</title>
		<link>http://rake.sh/blog/2006/09/17/ted-rheingold-dogsters-founder-and-top-dog-speaks-at-fowa/</link>
		<comments>http://rake.sh/blog/2006/09/17/ted-rheingold-dogsters-founder-and-top-dog-speaks-at-fowa/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Sep 2006 20:17:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>rakesh</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[futureofwebapps]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[futureofwebapps-06]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[General]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[tedrheingold]]></category>

		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://rake.sh/blog/?p=153</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Ted&#8217;s talk was one of the best at the Future of Web Apps conference last week. His talk was entitled &#8220;The State, Future &#038; Business of Passion-centric Online Communities&#8221; and he spent half the presentation (or maybe less) talking about Dogster and Catster and general guiding principals for passion-centric online communities. And the last half [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><img align="right" src="http://static.flickr.com/68/178528787_e8ac3e2ce4_m.jpg" />Ted&#8217;s talk was one of the best at the Future of Web Apps conference last week.  His talk was entitled &#8220;The State, Future &#038; Business of Passion-centric Online Communities&#8221; and he spent half the presentation (or maybe less) talking about Dogster and Catster and general guiding principals for passion-centric online communities.  And the last half or so of the presentation was dedicated to a review of 20-30 different such communities&#8211; the latter part was awesome, a lot of fun and a great survey of online communities.</p>
<p>Ted also touched on how he believed communities would exist wherever there members are and that accordingly, you&#8217;d see them everywhere from mobile phones, to DVRs, PDAs, mobile game devices, and so on.  This is something that I&#8217;ve always believed (something that&#8217;s reflected in some of the newer things that we&#8217;re doing at SnapStream) and Ted&#8217;s the first I&#8217;ve heard reinforce this notion.</p>
<p>My notes&#8230;</p>
<p>Ted Rheingold &#8211; Founder / Top Dog<br />
blogs: <a href="http://blog.dogster.com">blog.dogster.com</a> &#038; <a href="http://spideysenses.com">spideysenses.com</a></p>
<p><strong>Passion-centric Whats</strong><br />
- passion centric online communities are spaces dedicated to a single particular interest<br />
- they usually include human profile sharing, posting of passion-specific items and offer member-to-member and member-to-group communication possibilities</p>
<p><strong>Other likely feautres</strong><br />
- design, copy, and UI that only refelct the site user&#8217;s passion, they amplify it<br />
- moderation is key: a community is a  garden and that needs sincere consistent care<br />
- clearly stated ground rules that are community initated and community approved<br />
- precised and considerate safety policies with lots of opt-in/opt-out</p>
<p><strong>Sincerity cannot be faked</strong><br />
- people&#8217;s passions do not fit into silos<br />
- using topic agnostic community software will rarely captivate your commnity<br />
- if you ignore your community at any time for any length they will feel it and look elsewhere</p>
<p><strong>Dogster &#038; Catster&#8217;s frontpages:</strong></p>
<p>(single code base, every cat word is specific &#8212; cats naps, dogs do tricks)<br />
(regular cat page, samoa&#8230; blue ribbons, only subscribers can give blue ribbons and they disappear after 30 days &#8212; came straight from the forums)<br />
(like locker in high school)<br />
(profile pages are completely customizable)<br />
(meet her feline friends)</p>
<p><strong>Forums</strong><br />
- custom coded, don&#8217;t have to register to other forums</p>
<p><strong>Dogster</strong><br />
- diary central, 36,000 dogs keeping diaries, most all of them are writen from the standpoint of the pets<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<strong> Aggregate data</strong><br />
20.5 million virtual treats given<br />
7.6 million distrinct friendships<br />
289,000 dog and cat profiles<br />
252,000 human members<br />
50,000 pets keep diaries<br />
16k logins yesterday<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<strong> Da&#8217; Biz</strong><br />
Not too many revenue options</p>
<p>- advertising and sponsorships (3rd party ads, affiliate programs and bounties rarely pay more than your expenses)<br />
- subscription programs: a good goal is that the commmunity should be able to support it&#8217;s own existence<br />
- selling member-made or site specific items: even better way than memberships fees for community to support itself<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<strong> How to make advertising work</strong><br />
- keep your ad sales inside no one will be able to voney your memeber&#8217;s passion better than yourself (bring it in and your numbers will increase 10 fold)<br />
- advertisers need to have a direct connection to the communities passions<br />
- CPM is almost dead, for an advertisers message to be heard deliver it in the site voice and in place swhere members are receptive to messaging<br />
- require advertisers to offer something real to the community.  something that requires them to participate and become trusted</p>
<p>(if you are doing well, $8 CPM, 3rd party services get down to $0.10 &#8211; $0.25 CPM)</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<strong> Circle of Trust</strong><br />
Dogster -> Community -> Advertisers -></p>
<p>(community should like the product, advertiser should be happy)</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<strong> Future of passion-centric online communities</strong></p>
<p>- for every passion there will be a dedicated&#8217;ster&#8217; and there can easily be more than one popular &#8216;ster&#8217; passion<br />
- there will be tens of thousnads of pasion-centric online communitiesi in 10 years<br />
- public APIs badges and mini-sites widgets will bring communities to where the mbmber already is<br />
- public/open ID system will be used<br />
- the web is just the launchign point, think cell phones, mms, pdas, console-gaming, hand-held games (PSP/DS), DVRs, car-based computers, <strong>communities will meet where their members are</strong></p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://www.DeviantArt.com">DeviantArt</a> &#8212; started in 2001<br />
35 people<br />
2+ million members<br />
25 milliions pages serves / day<br />
alexa: 177, google PR 7/10<br />
18k online at one point in time<br />
community mood<br />
besides subscription, they sell prints that people make<br />
revenues from subscriptions and orders of member art</p>
<p>ettiquette policy: this is not about being a jerk<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://www.amateurillustrator.com/">amateur illustrator</a> (based in England, brand new)<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://www.cnet.com/">CNet</a> &#8212; alot of community in it, amazing job in bringing in advetrisers into the community<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://popsugar.com/">PopSugar</a> &#8212; blogging site with interesting products for hip people, make a profile on there, blog, comments, bookmark all your favorite items<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://www.modelmayhem.com/">Model Mayhem</a><br />
Alexa 3896, Google PR 3/10</p>
<p>Models and photographers only<br />
amazing set of rules: no pornography, no GWC (guys with cameras)</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://www.mlgpro.com/">major league gaming</a><br />
- halo and microsof tgames<br />
- they have a tv shows<br />
- hour long visitor sessions in 2004<br />
- president: michael sepster<br />
- website is just to bring people in and make them happy<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://autos.yahoo.com/">Yahoo Autos</a><br />
- people add photos of their car<br />
- deep integration, photos, features, modifications<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
Edmunds &#8212; <a href="http://www.carspace.com/">Carspace</a><br />
- old company, trying to make a stir<br />
- try to find the word car &#8212; it&#8217;s not there very much, not good<br />
- lagging behind on alexa<br />
- forums: are boring, &#8220;talk about your car&#8221;, too much advertising</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://www.boompa.com/">boompa</a>&#8211; car site from cnet<br />
- your garage online<br />
- add your ride<br />
- random ride, battles<br />
- must better than the edmunds site<br />
- ask the community</p>
<p>- browse guides by categories or model<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://www.faniq.com/">faniq</a>: all about sports people<br />
- college or university, good job of replicating a sports fan environment<br />
- every team that has to elect a commissioner<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://feelingbullish.com/">Feelingbullish.com</a><br />
- one of the few that&#8217;s wokring on a reputation system (has been elusive to deploy, lot of ways to game it)<br />
- stock fan site, get people to stick by their picks and earn your reputation accordingly</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://www.socialpicks.com/about/beta">Social picks</a>&#8211; putting a faec behind investments<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://www.mybloglog.com/">MyBlogLog</a><br />
- people who have read my blog recently<br />
- messages below&#8211; two lines of javascript that I put on every page<br />
- 30boxes<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://www.famster.com/">Famster</a><br />
- sharing families online<br />
- &#8220;safe, fun and free&#8221;<br />
- the safest way to share on the Internet<br />
- can&#8217;t get a good feel for them<br />
- could be huge in China (?)<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://www.thefamilypost.com/">TheFamilyPost</a><br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://www.clubmom.com/">Club Mom</a><br />
Alexa: 11,105<br />
GooglePR: 4/10<br />
Funding to date: $50M<br />
- they are killing with advertising, but they started during web1.0<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://www.minti.com/">Minti</a> is a baby site<br />
- frontpage is a mess which is fine<br />
- I could see 30 baby sites being successful<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://www.teachade.com/">Teachade</a><br />
- share workplan, calendars<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://craftster.org/"> Craftster.org</a><br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://vampirefreaks.com/"> VampireFreaks.org</a><br />
- goth enthusiast sites<br />
600,000 members<br />
Alexa: 4,105<br />
Google PR: 5/10<br />
2-3k members online anytime<br />
4+ million forum posts<br />
backgorund color is black, links are purple<br />
&#8220;fuck the mainstream&#8221;<br />
page is probably not w3c compliant (ha)<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://www.yourclimbing.com/"> YourClimbing</a><br />
&#8211; made with Drupal<br />
&#8211; person on the homepage<br />
YourMTB.com<br />
- first site for this<br />
- upload photos, videos, etc.<br />
- you register and we&#8217;ll give you a free bumper sticker<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://www.everytrail.net/">EveryTrail</a><br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://cuteoverload.com/">CuteOverload</a><br />
- new realm of community<br />
- using blogging software<br />
- &#8216;commenting is community&#8217;<br />
- they won a webby<br />
- they use ning&#8211; topic agnostic &#8212; for &#8220;caption me&#8221;<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
search on &#8216;cats&#8217; in Google&#8211; two communites in the top 10 hits<br />
AboutCom&#8217;s Cats<br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://catsinsinks.com/"> Cats in Sinks</a><br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://www.stuffonmycat.com/"> Stuff on my cat</a><br />
&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8211;<br />
<a href="http://www.catsthatlooklikehitler.com/">CatsThatLookLikeHitler.com</a></p>
<p>Kitlers&#8211; cats that look like hitler</p>
<p>(photograph above by <a href="http://www.laughingsquid.com/">Scott Beale</a> and <a href="http://flickr.com/photos/laughingsquid/178528787/">hosted on flickr</a>)</p>
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